Unlike the RTWTD the DCPC wil be easy for the authorities to check at the roadside as it is a legal requirement to carry the DQC at all times when driving commercially (like the digicard)
10.–(1) A person who does not comply with regulation 4(1) or 9(1) is guilty of an offence.
(2) A person who causes or permits another person to drive a relevant vehicle on a road in breach of regulation 4(1) or 9(1) is guilty of an offence.
(3) A person guilty of an offence under this regulation shall be liable upon summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 3 on the standard scale.
As I’ve said in another post the other day, I doubt many drivers will get the option of chancing it by driving without having completed the DCPC training, there may be a few rogue companies and some ignorant ones but for the most part I can’t see many companies being prepared to allow a driver to take a vehicle out if he’s not legally entitled to drive it commercially.
Apart from the fact that they would be putting their operators license at risk, If stopped I assume that VOSA would put an immediate PG9 on the vehicle and not lift it until a legal driver was available to drive the vehicle, there’s also the question of insurance if the driver isn’t entitled to drive the vehicle commercially.
I’ve no idea whether or not VOSA intend to enforce the law regarding DCPC training but I imagine they will whether they like it or not, there’s too much money at stake for the government to allow them to ignore this regulation.
But yes, I agree that it would be foolish to “chance it” after September 2014
tachograph:
I doubt they’ll usually need to ask, I imagine VOSA will have the information on an easily accessible database.
Ian Bacon, senior policy engineer for strategy and performance, at Vosa, told delegates at the Driver CPC Conference, powered by CM: “It is an offence to fail to produce the card to a Vosa examiner. We will prosecute you with no leniency, and we will probably trigger an investigation into the company as well. We will expect operators to ensure that the driver is carrying his card.”
The offence of failing to produce the DQC when requested is not prohibitable, just like driving other than in accordance with a licence. However, further driving of the vehicle is most likely to end in an appearance before the Magistrates and possibly the TC. The operator is most likely to receive ‘a visit’ as they let you out of the yard without checking DQC status.
Driving many of the ‘tradesmans’ vehicles will be exempt dCPC, so no need to produce a DQC.
The lack of a DQC may not effect the insurance position. The dCPC is not required to drive a vehicle ‘privately’ so I could drive a 44 tonne artic horsebox provided that I’m doing it non commercially provided that I have my C+E licence. It’s the holding of the appropriate entitlements on your licence that the insurance companies are interested in, which you will have once you have passed the necessary test.
geebee45:
The offence of failing to produce the DQC when requested is not prohibitable, just like driving other than in accordance with a licence. However, further driving of the vehicle is most likely to end in an appearance before the Magistrates and possibly the TC. The operator is most likely to receive ‘a visit’ as they let you out of the yard without checking DQC status.
Driving many of the ‘tradesmans’ vehicles will be exempt dCPC, so no need to produce a DQC.
The lack of a DQC may not effect the insurance position. The dCPC is not required to drive a vehicle ‘privately’ so I could drive a 44 tonne artic horsebox provided that I’m doing it non commercially provided that I have my C+E licence. It’s the holding of the appropriate entitlements on your licence that the insurance companies are interested in, which you will have once you have passed the necessary test.
geebee45. In your capacity as a senior staff member of the “enemy,” are you not concerned about the privateer status of the DCPC and its trainers. There has been a lot of misinformation posted on this site and others about the method of teaching and the content of the courses.
If I decided to set myself up as a private driving examiner, my idea would be laughed at, which is why DSA approve their examiners and can pull the plug just as quickly.
I would like to hear your views along with your colleagues. I have long been behind proper structured training for drivers, but cannot find anything in JAUPT or Skills for Logistics that is any more than a money generation scheme.
I am also against the word “commercially,” Trucks being driven on the roads are there for a reason, whether that is Priscilla taking her eventing or show jumping ponies to a show or Chris Hooper going to the middle east. Both are doing it because they love it, they both get rewarded for it, yet the Murphy driver who is on contract to the council or BT with an excavator or road roller behind his lorry I presume will not need a CPC as his main job isn’t a lorry driver, but a road construction worker or labourer.
1 - If the driver does not have a DQC is the driver stopped from driving any further?
2 - If the driver has a DQC but cannot produce it are they stopped from driving any further?
Will either if the above apply across the EU?
1 answered by the words in my original post ‘not prohibitable.’
2 see answer to (1)
What happens in rest of EU? Short answer; I don’t know. Knowing how some Member States ‘police’ other matters I’m sure that there will be some fun & games.
In answer to Wheel Nuts’ post;
These are purely my thoughts and are not to be taken as representative of my employers views (whoever they may happen to be).
I’m aware that some of the information given out on courses is at best misleading and possibly at worst downright dangerous. Also aware that some training providers seem hell bent on circumnavigating the system by running ‘non attendance’ courses or 3 hours down the pub and watching the footie courses. If I get evidence of such activities then it gets reported to the appropriate body - JAUPT. What they do with the info is up to them. But I guess the situation is pretty much like any regulation in road transport, for some, if the regulation doesn’t suit then they’ll break it.
I’ve been on one drivers hours & tacho training session. I couldn’t do a mystery shopper on the day because I’m known to the trainer. I found in this particular instance that the material was correct and the trainer coped really well with some disruption from a group who mainly drive on domestic regs and had issues with EU regs when they applied. I found it really hard to keep quiet when we did the group multiple choice and short answer questions at the end of the course
Personally I think there should be more ‘mystery shopper’ checks on courses and content but the big question as to who pays for this has yet to be answered.
With regard to ‘reward’ and horseboxes. Very very few will get any reward for competing in competitions. Whilst the likes of Zara, William Fox-Pitt, Mary King etc are at the top of their game, there are tens of thousands who compete at lower level events who will never even see the return of their entry money let alone the cost of their diesel. Effectively their driving is ‘private’ in nature and I don’t have any issues with them being exempt this legislation. Now, as for the ‘occasional drivers’ those working on roads, utilities, scaffolding etc. I have no problem with them requiring dCPC, unfortunately the Legislators decided to give them an exemption, so that is the end of the matter.
I’m taking the day off that day (in fact I might take the week off), because EVERY VOSA guy they can find will be out that day checking cards. I reckon they will be aiming to stop every truck that they can to check them for DQCs. You’ll be lucky if you don’t get stopped at least once in the week…
1 - If the driver does not have a DQC is the driver stopped from driving any further?
2 - If the driver has a DQC but cannot produce it are they stopped from driving any further?
Will either if the above apply across the EU?
1 answered by the words in my original post ‘not prohibitable.’
2 see answer to (1)
What happens in rest of EU? Short answer; I don’t know. Knowing how some Member States ‘police’ other matters I’m sure that there will be some fun & games.
It wont be scrapped unfortunately, but this part could be made compulsory, although it seems it is only available in Hampshire at the moment.
The Driver Certificate of Professional Competence (CPC), an EU Directive, came into force in 08/09 to maintain high driving standards and improve road safety. It requires all PCV and LGV drivers to complete 35 hours of training, which can include first aid, every five years. Yet 81% of those required to carry out Driver CPC training have not started.
If drivers are caught without proof of compliance after September 2013 (for PCVs) and September 2014 (for LGVs) then they face on-the-spot fines and an investigation which may lead to them losing their vocational licence and, thereby, their livelihood.
The new St John Ambulance Professional drivers first aid course has been approved by the Joint Approvals Unit for Periodic Training (JAUPT) which validates Driver CPC training.
That’s a polite way of saying RTFQ. 