matamoros:
I see that both of you are offering specialised services where downtime is a major factor and cost/mile is not the prime revenue earner. I have been sub contracting to the same firm for more than twelve years, admittedly things are not good at the moment. I work pretty well every day, get paid on 30 days from month end by a rock solid firm, I don’t get £1.50 a mile (my tacho) but even in these hard times still make a living.
Quoting a simplistic figure of £2 a mile is cloud cuckoo land and simplistic at the best.
I completely agree, 95% of my work is subbing for Gregory Distribution and I don’t earn anything like £2 a mile but I still make a perfectly adequate living at it. I would imagine that most people who say things like “I wouldn’t get out of bed for less than £2 a mile” have either never run a truck or have, and have gone bust in the process.
And i would say those that moan about not getting anymore than £1.50 p/m from another haulier need to pull their heads out of the sand and start knocking on doors. This obsession with mileage rates is what keeps you all under the [zb] heel. Talk to potential customers, their needs etc and if they’re interested in using you price a few of their jobs for them. Forgrt the bloody mileage thing.
Standing costs & running costs plus PROFIT…
£2 p/mile is meaningless, it needs to be in context.
If, however you’re content with the scraps from the table, give me a ring, I’ll work you!
Exactly the point I am making.
I have done direct customer work in the past, some good, some not so good.Basically got fed up being at the beck and call of and being ■■■■■■ about by unreasonable customers. I am under no one’s ***** heel, I have developed a long term relationship with the firm I sub for, I don’t even know how my rates are calculated but I calculate a pence per actual mile for cost control and comparison purposes. The rates are not good at the moment admittedly but survivable.
Perhaps we don’t all have your business acumen and sales skills
In the 30 years I have been an owner operator I have seen many rising stars expand and then flat on their arses after a few years.
matamoros:
I see that both of you are offering specialised services where downtime is a major factor and cost/mile is not the prime revenue earner. I have been sub contracting to the same firm for more than twelve years, admittedly things are not good at the moment. I work pretty well every day, get paid on 30 days from month end by a rock solid firm, I don’t get £1.50 a mile (my tacho) but even in these hard times still make a living.
Quoting a simplistic figure of £2 a mile is cloud cuckoo land and simplistic at the best.
I completely agree, 95% of my work is subbing for Gregory Distribution and I don’t earn anything like £2 a mile but I still make a perfectly adequate living at it. I would imagine that most people who say things like “I wouldn’t get out of bed for less than £2 a mile” have either never run a truck or have, and have gone bust in the process.
And i would say those that moan about not getting anymore than £1.50 p/m from another haulier need to pull their heads out of the sand and start knocking on doors. This obsession with mileage rates is what keeps you all under the [zb] heel. Talk to potential customers, their needs etc and if they’re interested in using you price a few of their jobs for them. Forgrt the bloody mileage thing.
Standing costs & running costs plus PROFIT…
£2 p/mile is meaningless, it needs to be in context.
If, however you’re content with the scraps from the table, give me a ring, I’ll work you!
Exactly the point I am making.
I have done direct customer work in the past, some good, some not so good.Basically got fed up being at the beck and call of and being ■■■■■■ about by unreasonable customers. I am under no one’s ***** heel, I have developed a long term relationship with the firm I sub for, I don’t even know how my rates are calculated but I calculate a pence per actual mile for cost control and comparison purposes. The rates are not good at the moment admittedly but survivable.
Perhaps we don’t all have your business acumen and sales skills
In the 30 years I have been an owner operator I have seen many rising stars expand and then flat on their arses after a few years.
I am still here
Good for you sir. You’ve obviously found the holy grail of haulage then…
Forgive this fly by night upstart with his “acumen” wishing to see a return.
MR VAIN:
All those Big V8’s pulling trailers of the docks must be running on fresh air. (Just going by the general opinion of this thread)
It’s a long time since I pulled someone’s trailer off a dock, I’m sure there is a few good jobs but not many, a shiney V8 don’t mean the jobs any good,
Better to watch where his missus shops, aldi or waitrose
There are two types of owner driver, some like Harry and Mr Vain who are dedicated sub contractors for a large haulier, what they have is, basically, a lorry driving job where they own the equipment and some like Goaty, who are hauliers that have one lorry.
Each will have different expectations of rates/workload.
Franchise O/Ds get paid for miles travelled/deliveries/collections/trailer swaps, so to get a decent living they want to get as much done as possible.
Small hauliers will want to do as little as possible and work smarter, rather than harder to maximise their profits.
It is no secret which way I think is best, but there is no right or wrong way, if you are paying the bills and earning a living that you are happy with, then good luck to you.
On another note, not every job needs a 44t vehicle, you don’t have to be nailed to the floor all the time! In fact you could earn the same or more profit on a lower gross as your costs will be lower
newmercman:
There are two types of owner driver, some like Harry and Mr Vain who are dedicated sub contractors for a large haulier, what they have is, basically, a lorry driving job where they own the equipment and some like Goaty, who are hauliers that have one lorry.
Each will have different expectations of rates/workload.
Franchise O/Ds get paid for miles travelled/deliveries/collections/trailer swaps, so to get a decent living they want to get as much done as possible.
Small hauliers will want to do as little as possible and work smarter, rather than harder to maximise their profits.
It is no secret which way I think is best, but there is no right or wrong way, if you are paying the bills and earning a living that you are happy with, then good luck to you.
On another note, not every job needs a 44t vehicle, you don’t have to be nailed to the floor all the time! In fact you could earn the same or more profit on a lower gross as your costs will be lower
I must admit to getting very passionate about this subject, to the point of being perceived as a clever ■■■■■ What you say is ultimately true NMM. I cannot see the point of making all the effort and commitment to get the truck working only to stop there and accept the scraps from others tables. Each to their own of course.
I can see the attraction of subbing ,for some its the only way as they can’t afford to stand ,I know of blokes who subbed until retirement and never got anywhere ,I don’t know how many customers I have although I invoice around 20 per month ,10 every month and the other 10 vary a bit ,I guess about 40 regular ones .i did once sub to a small haulier his saying was "we will make it up on another load " when the rate was poor ,it never happened ,he went bust in the end ,where he suffered with his artics was he’d quote £500 say,then such as a large out fit would qoute £450’ then a subbie would take the load for £ 400 .
One of the reasons I choose to sub is I know that the money is 100% guaranteed, it goes into the bank at 11:35 on the first day of the month, every single time without fail. There’s no point working for twice as much if the bloke goes bust the day before he’s due to pay you, and this has happened to more people I know than I care to remember. I know the maths, the maths stack up.
I do my own work now and then and it pays a fair amount more, I look on subbing as my bread and butter, and the rest as jam. But the point is, I make enough at subbing to make it more than worth my while, even when it’s a long spell of bread and butter time. And as I’ve also said, it’s not just about the money, just look in the PDF at the numerous posts where drivers aren’t even allowed to stop for a ■■■■ or take a day off when they want to.
I’ve said it so many times, if you have a good job, with a good boss then you’re better off sticking with that. But, if you choose the right truck, i.e. not £95,000’s worth of brand new 700 bhp Scania with £15,000’s worth of Shania Twains airbrushed all over it, and if you sub for a firm which has a long-term interest in using subbies as part of it’s business model then you can make a reasonable living at it.
Owner driving has always been as Harry describes, you have a job that pays a little bit more and gives a little more freedom. It has added risks, such as breakdowns and other PITA things, but if you budget properly they shouldn’t send you skint.
The small haulier on the other hand wants more, more choice, more freedom, more money and they know that it can bring more headaches. Like being an Owner Driver they will also have to budget carefully and make sure that the customers that are paying higher rates have the ability and willingness to pay them.
A properly run small haulier would be far less of a headache than a badly organised Owner Driver and a properly organised Owner Driver will have far less headaches than a badly run small haulier. Financially the same rules apply.
matamoros:
I see that both of you are offering specialised services where downtime is a major factor and cost/mile is not the prime revenue earner. I have been sub contracting to the same firm for more than twelve years, admittedly things are not good at the moment. I work pretty well every day, get paid on 30 days from month end by a rock solid firm, I don’t get £1.50 a mile (my tacho) but even in these hard times still make a living.
Quoting a simplistic figure of £2 a mile is cloud cuckoo land and simplistic at the best.
I completely agree, 95% of my work is subbing for Gregory Distribution and I don’t earn anything like £2 a mile but I still make a perfectly adequate living at it. I would imagine that most people who say things like “I wouldn’t get out of bed for less than £2 a mile” have either never run a truck or have, and have gone bust in the process.
We have been running trucks here for 45 years ! , and we average above £2 per mile and not gone bust in those 45 years
An owner driver will not have the same overheads as you may have. No office , no staff , no premises etc. Bigger you are the more overheads you will have and hence need a decent rate to make it feasible.
Harry Monk:
One of the reasons I choose to sub is I know that the money is 100% guaranteed, it goes into the bank at 11:35 on the first day of the month, every single time without fail. There’s no point working for twice as much if the bloke goes bust the day before he’s due to pay you, and this has happened to more people I know than I care to remember. I know the maths, the maths stack up.
I do my own work now and then and it pays a fair amount more, I look on subbing as my bread and butter, and the rest as jam. But the point is, I make enough at subbing to make it more than worth my while, even when it’s a long spell of bread and butter time. And as I’ve also said, it’s not just about the money, just look in the PDF at the numerous posts where drivers aren’t even allowed to stop for a ■■■■ or take a day off when they want to.
I’ve said it so many times, if you have a good job, with a good boss then you’re better off sticking with that. But, if you choose the right truck, i.e. not £95,000’s worth of brand new 700 bhp Scania with £15,000’s worth of Shania Twains airbrushed all over it, and if you sub for a firm which has a long-term interest in using subbies as part of it’s business model then you can make a reasonable living at it.
Where did you see that Scania for sale, at 95k that’s a snip!!!
Opinions vary. My situation with the haulier that I choose to work for suits me very well. I work everyday and I get paid a fair rate for the jobs that I do.
The world of being an owner driver doesn’t get any easier with the progression of time. From my point of view, the introduction of euro 5/6 technology just adds financial burden. No longer can you get yr spanners out on yr engine to limp home. For example, an EGR engine runs a variable vane turbo, at almost 3 times the cost of a conventional turbo, the news that the life span is apparently shorter is certainly bad news.
does anyone no companies that are alright for pulling for around Manchester which for me seems a dead area ive got two motors doing what they do but I want to stay away from what there doing I need to try and take some different work for a truck or truck and curtainsider getting sick and tired of earning good money on a Monday ok on Tuesday nowt for a Wednesday etc etc i no about traction rates when ive rung in the past for work off the docks east or west of the 62 all I get is we would struggle getting you back home which has made it a waste of time but am also starting to wish id never bought a curtainsider as everyone wants it today but no one wants it tomorrow i no i can get better rates myself but am suffering from a bit of inconsistency
luck ran out about 12 months ago nothing but problems with silly breakdowns ,stupid damages, scams ! etc etc to name a few new year new start chop change swap and sell if I have to need to take on new customers to fill in with what ive got or take or new permanent customers.
