dieseldave:
Having seen how many of us old hands have posted that we have the 107 restriction, do you think DVLA has made the same “mistake” with all of our licences??
Whilst I agree with you, I’d have to admit that there are a lot of people who have said that they have licenses with the 01 restriction on all categories except C+E. I’m one of them. Therefore, I can drive around in an artic all day without glasses, but the moment I drop the trailer (or swap to my car), I’m required to put glasses on.
Surely this can’t be correct (it’s not logical), but it’s a “mistake” that DVLA have made on a lot of licenses.
dieseldave:
Having seen how many of us old hands have posted that we have the 107 restriction, do you think DVLA has made the same “mistake” with all of our licences??
Whilst I agree with you, I’d have to admit that there are a lot of people who have said that they have licenses with the 01 restriction on all categories except C+E. I’m one of them. Therefore, I can drive around in an artic all day without glasses, but the moment I drop the trailer (or swap to my car), I’m required to put glasses on.
Surely this can’t be correct (it’s not logical), but it’s a “mistake” that DVLA have made on a lot of licenses.
Haven’t done my C+E yet, but as there is no way on this earth that I’d so much as walk down the street without my trusty “gregs”, there is no way that I’d ever dream of driving a fully freighted artic without them - 01 restriction or no 01 restriction. Besides, I need them to make the standard for LGV driving…
SuperLez:
Haven’t done my C+E yet, but as there is no way on this earth that I’d so much as walk down the street without my trusty “gregs”, there is no way that I’d ever dream of driving a fully freighted artic without them - 01 restriction or no 01 restriction. Besides, I need them to make the standard for LGV driving…
Maybe, but I don’t. I meet the standard without glasses. However, when I did my initial license application, I ticked the box “I need glasses for LGV” because I didn’t know whether the numbers meant that I passed or failed, and frankly, I couldn’t be bothered to go back to the doctor and find out.
Somehow, the DVLA have mutated that into “needs glasses for everything except C+E”.
MrFlibble:
Whilst I agree with you, I’d have to admit that there are a lot of people who have said that they have licenses with the 01 restriction on all categories except C+E. I’m one of them. Therefore, I can drive around in an artic all day without glasses, but the moment I drop the trailer (or swap to my car), I’m required to put glasses on.
Surely this can’t be correct (it’s not logical), but it’s a “mistake” that DVLA have made on a lot of licenses.
I wasn’t saying that either burnie or DVLA are wrong. I just wondered as to the likelihood of DVLA getting so many licences “wrong” and if it’s a mistake, why wasn’t it corrected at renewal??
I’ve had to have 2 renewals since I reached 45 and my 107 is still there.
Maybe it’s to do with the fact that C1 (for most of us) is on our car licence, which doesn’t need renewal for a much longer period.
As for the 01 restriction, I wouldn’t dream of driving anything without wearing my trusty binns.
Having thought further about it, it’s perfectly possible that there’s some sort of mistake on DVLA’s part that has gone unnoticed. Who knows??
This in particular applies to non LGV/PCV licence holders and focuses on car licences held before 1997.
When the CPC comes in, what happens to these grandad C1/D1 licences? Regular users of TRUCKNET know that these aren’t real “vocational” licences and come with all kinds of baggage. In the case of C1, you can’t use it on the continent, you can’t instruct learners ( I only learned this recently!) and in the case of C1+E there is of course that 8.25t train weight restriction.
As for D1, you can’t use this in Europe, aren’t allowed to use them for “hire or reward” here, or once again, you can’t instruct L drivers.
As the CPC is a recognised professional qualification throughout the EU, what will happen to these licences? To use them professionally, drivers will obviously have to take the CPC. Does this mean that grandad D1 licence holders lose their entitlement? Remember that as things stand at the moment, they can’t use them professionally. As dual current LGV/PCV licence holders only have to complete the 35 hours of training over 5 years, will they be allowed to carry passengers in minibuses for hire or reward should they wish to continue driving 7.5 tonners?
From our point of view, the most interesting subject is C1 and in particular the C1+E with the 8.25t restriction. Will the restiction be removed should they gain the CPC? They have the entitlement on their licence - and national restrictions aren’t recognised throughout Europe. As a C licence holder, I have a vocational licence and I HAVE to take the CPC and I already have all this other “fruit salad” on my licence. As far as I can see, I can drive a 7.5 tonner with a drag (up to 12t MAM) on the continent as things stand at the moment as I have a vocational licence and C1+E entitlement - even though I haven’t taken a trailer test!
Remember, that it is a requirement for drivers upgrading to C1/D1 from B to meet the same medical standards that C or D drivers have to. Is it now time to force such drivers to take tests to hold onto these entitlements? I can’t see any half way house for these licences now.
dieseldave:
I wasn’t saying that either burnie or DVLA are wrong.
No, and I’m not saying that you are wrong, just that there are precedents for the DVLA making the same “mistake” in multiple cases.
SuperLez:
As for D1, you can’t use this in Europe
Are you sure? I know a lot of people that have driven minibuses to the continent on a pre-97 D1 license.
Certainly, on a post-97 license, the UK has given a special derogation so that people with B licenses can drive D1 with particular restrictions (not for hire or reward, driver must be volunteer, vehicle used for specific purposes, and overall weight limit (2.5 tonnes I think)), and that only applies to the UK.
However, I’m pretty sure that the old D1 entitlement is valid in Europe.
Mr. Flibble. A pre 1997 D1 inherited with passing cat B (or A as it used to be - cars ) is not for hire and reward. The rest of Europe never had this cat. If they wanted D1 they had to pass the test.
That is why if ever you were stopped on the mainland you should have carried documents to prove that there was no hire or reward element whatsoever. A lot of people got away with it ,some did not. Ther have been a lot of minibuses turned back as the driver did not have a full D1
dieseldave:
I wasn’t saying that either burnie or DVLA are wrong.
No, and I’m not saying that you are wrong, just that there are precedents for the DVLA making the same “mistake” in multiple cases.
SuperLez:
As for D1, you can’t use this in Europe
Are you sure? I know a lot of people that have driven minibuses to the continent on a pre-97 D1 license.
Certainly, on a post-97 license, the UK has given a special derogation so that people with B licenses can drive D1 with particular restrictions (not for hire or reward, driver must be volunteer, vehicle used for specific purposes, and overall weight limit (2.5 tonnes I think)), and that only applies to the UK.
However, I’m pretty sure that the old D1 entitlement is valid in Europe.
Of course, the Section 19 Small Bus Permits aren’t valid in Europe, so if you’re running hire-or-reward for any reason (and that includes community groups, youth clubs, etc.), then your D1(101) isn’t valid.
dieseldave:
I wasn’t saying that either burnie or DVLA are wrong.
No, and I’m not saying that you are wrong, just that there are precedents for the DVLA making the same “mistake” in multiple cases.
SuperLez:
As for D1, you can’t use this in Europe
Are you sure? I know a lot of people that have driven minibuses to the continent on a pre-97 D1 license.
Certainly, on a post-97 license, the UK has given a special derogation so that people with B licenses can drive D1 with particular restrictions (not for hire or reward, driver must be volunteer, vehicle used for specific purposes, and overall weight limit (2.5 tonnes I think)), and that only applies to the UK.
However, I’m pretty sure that the old D1 entitlement is valid in Europe.
Of course, the Section 19 Small Bus Permits aren’t valid in Europe, so if you’re running hire-or-reward for any reason (and that includes community groups, youth clubs, etc.), then your D1(101) isn’t valid.
ICBW, though…
Grandfather D1(101) is only valid for a 100% private trip abroad, any whiff of any other use would be. The fact that the (101) bit is abused in the UK is a complete nonsense.
Mr. flibble let me put it another way then.
The D1 inherited with car license is not for hire and reward in this country agreed?
On mainland europe they only had a full D1 after passing their test. Therefore they would not accept our “not for hire and reward version”. Or to put it another way they would not recognise it.
mrpj
You have to have passed a test (not inherited) the license cat. for the vehicle that you are sitting next to the learner in.
Mr. flibble you have answered your own question.
D1 (101) is Not for hire and reward here.
On mainland Europe they do not have D1 (101) only D1 so they would/will not recognise ours.
mrpj
you have to have passed the test for the cat. of license (not inherited) for the type of vehicle that the learner is driving.
D1 (101) is not for hire and reward in this country.
On mainland Europe they do not have (101) so they do not recognise it.They have always had to pass the test unlike pre 1997 here they did not get it with their car license.
You cannot sit next to a learner now unless you have passed the test for that particular class of vehicle (not acquired it under grandfather rights).
What has the cpc got to do with license categories on your licence?
I also have a 107 restriction on my C1. I passed my C+E in 1992, when there was no requirement to take a C first. I’ve never actually driven a C1+E but have wondered how I would stand in court, defending my lack of a licenece to drive one!
disgo:
Mr. Flibble. A pre 1997 D1 inherited with passing cat B (or A as it used to be - cars ) is not for hire and reward. The rest of Europe never had this cat. If they wanted D1 they had to pass the test.
That is why if ever you were stopped on the mainland you should have carried documents to prove that there was no hire or reward element whatsoever. A lot of people got away with it ,some did not. Ther have been a lot of minibuses turned back as the driver did not have a full D1
So, what you’re saying is that I’m right.
A D1 (not for hire or reward) is valid on the continent.
It’s just that they want you to have a bit more proof that it’s “not for hire or reward”, whereas in this country, it doesn’t seem to be enforced much (I’m sure that lots of self-drive minibus are actually used for “hire and reward” under the legal definition, even though most hire agreements explicitly exclude it).
Tony1968:
I also have a 107 restriction on my C1. I passed my C+E in 1992, when there was no requirement to take a C first. I’ve never actually driven a C1+E but have wondered how I would stand in court, defending my lack of a licenece to drive one!
As a C+E licence holder you can drive any C1+E. The 107 restriction would only be in force if you did not hold your C+E any more.
Reply to an e-mail that I sent to DVLA
Thank you for your email.
I can confirm that C1E (107restriction) will remain on a driving licence once entitlement to drive vehicles of category C+E has expired .
Regards
Graham Williams www.direct.gov.uk/motoring
