th2013:
Strangely as far as I can tell this change does NOT apply to car + trailer tests. Not that this will affect many on here, but seems to be the case that can have a manual car license, sit a B+E test in an auto and still only be allowed to tow trailers with an auto car. Can’t work that one out…
Nor can the DSA but they did state that part is under UK law not EU law so they expect the legislators to change that next time the laws are looked at especially as NI already has B manual then BE auto giving BE manual
rogerreno:
I’m one of these people you speak of, having driven 8 wheel tippers since 2003 I finally got round to doing my Class 1 so I could move up to the artics.
Now the guy who I did my test and lessons with had got on top of this new legislation and traded his old Scania 4 series in for a MAN Auto wagon and drag, telling me that it was coming in at end of January so not to worry about it, you’ll pass in my auto and gain a full manual licence.
All good I thought, till the morning of test and the 1st thing the examiner told me was that if I pass in an auto i’d be restricted to an auto until the new regs came in (as there’d been a delay in it being passed)
So I passed my test and got my licence, yes thankfully I drive a MAN TGA 26 430 auto unit, so driving his made it more familiar for me but I felt cheated that I came away with a restricted licence…especially after passing my Class 2 in 2003 I went straight onto an ERF EC14 with an Eaton twin splitter (that I’m proud to say I mastered, a lovely box that i’d go back to tomorrow if I had the choice) so driving a manual wouldn’t have been an issue for me.
My only question now is how do I go about getting the restriction lifted? Is it going to cost me and if so how much??
I’ve been in my MAN (ooo eerr Mrs!!) since mid February, it just about goes where I want it to in reverse now and i’m enjoying being in the 'big boys club…wouldn’t go back to a rigid now!!
When did you do your test mate? what did the guy who you did your lessons with say about it?
rogerreno:
My only question now is how do I go about getting the restriction lifted? Is it going to cost me and if so how much??
FREE (according to DVLA sources if that is the only purpose) - you need to send licence to DVLA after 10th of this month - a covering note may be useful
rogerreno:
My only question now is how do I go about getting the restriction lifted? Is it going to cost me and if so how much??
FREE (according to DVLA sources if that is the only purpose) - you need to send licence to DVLA after 10th of this month - a covering note may be useful
Remember to take a copy of said licence before sending it off.
I have to see the funny side that I have my C+E test in a manual artic on 11th April! I can see “passed in a manual artic” being a phrase used in job applications from now on.
rogerreno:
My only question now is how do I go about getting the restriction lifted? Is it going to cost me and if so how much??
FREE (according to DVLA sources if that is the only purpose) - you need to send licence to DVLA after 10th of this month - a covering note may be useful
Remember to take a copy of said licence before sending it off.
Juddian:
The auto box is just another nail in the coffin of British Road Haulage, lorry driving, the art of, is just about dead now, lorry drivers no longer required, a steering wheel operative with its bum on the seat is all that’s needed.
The EU and all its dictats won, as is the modern British way of Lions voting for Donkeys, they surrendered for us without a shot being fired, and we bent over and complied.
Not sure what this has got to do with the EU. Technology is forever being developed / things invented to do stuff for us / make tasks easier. Naturally, this results in certain skills becoming obsolete. It’s just the way it is.
th2013:
I have to see the funny side that I have my C+E test in a manual artic on 11th April! I can see “passed in a manual artic” being a phrase used in job applications from now on.
I imagine so, although I think before long most driving schools will probably take away the option to learn in a manual. At the end of the day they are in the business of getting people through their test as quickly as possible & getting as many pupils in and out of the door as they can. Maybe ROG or someone might be able to give a better estimate, but I imagine teaching a student in an automatic could knock at least half a day of the amount of time to train.
Personally I never wanted an auto box but the time came when I had no choice and I still didn’t like it,but I’ve got on with it as I’ve got better things to do than moan and part of life is accepting change, so accept I did and though I’d prefer a manual the auto isn’t that bad especially when coming down hill and exhaust braking , I find it better! And 80% of the time I’ll drive it in manual, so apart from the lack of a clutch pedal not a lot of difference. I’d love to go back to a twin splitter but you didn’t need a clutch to operate those either,I’ve even started one up in gear and got home without a clutch pedal when I’ve had problems in the dark distant past.
When I passed my test I did it in a 6 speed Ford Cargo with an empty 30ft flat bed trailer. The next truck I drove was a F12 with 4 over 4 and a split on every gear and a loaded 45ft tilt on the back.
Why would I be any better prepared for driving a truck then, than somebody passing today in an auto, but with a full length, high sided and loaded trailer?
I also believe most modern trucks registered today are autos, and manuals are now an optional extra, so learning in an auto will be relevant to most people.
muckles:
When I passed my test I did it in a 6 speed Ford Cargo with an empty 30ft flat bed trailer. The next truck I drove was a F12 with 4 over 4 and a split on every gear and a loaded 45ft tilt on the back.
Why would I be any better prepared for driving a truck then, than somebody passing today in an auto, but with a full length, high sided and loaded trailer?
I also believe most modern trucks registered today are autos, and manuals are now an optional extra, so learning in an auto will be relevant to most people.
Used to be a bloke that did HGV training in my home town with a 4 speed Bedford TK with a trailer about as long as a transit van. Half of Stoke-on-Trent went with him.
learned & passed my test and in '77, drove an old (even then) Bedford then a Dodge skitter box on steep twisty narrow country roads for a lot of years, learned all about double de-clutching etc. Fast forward to 4 years ago and I had to resurrect my license, as an agency/‘newbie’ I was given every manual heap of crap still in the fleet, didn’t have an issue with them but given the choice I’ll take a unit with a modern autobox every time.
I reckon looking at some of the comments on here that some ‘real’ drivers would have lamented having to give up their horse and cart for a lorry when they first appeared
muckles:
When I passed my test I did it in a 6 speed Ford Cargo with an empty 30ft flat bed trailer. The next truck I drove was a F12 with 4 over 4 and a split on every gear and a loaded 45ft tilt on the back.
Why would I be any better prepared for driving a truck then, than somebody passing today in an auto, but with a full length, high sided and loaded trailer?
I guess there’s a certain amount of truth in this. You weren’t properly prepared back then which is why they brought in the driving test’s minimum requirement for a four over four. To prepare the driver for what goes on in the real world. The real world now is changing to autos. But there will always be a few manuals out there so why not leave the test as it is?
muckles:
When I passed my test I did it in a 6 speed Ford Cargo with an empty 30ft flat bed trailer. The next truck I drove was a F12 with 4 over 4 and a split on every gear and a loaded 45ft tilt on the back.
Why would I be any better prepared for driving a truck then, than somebody passing today in an auto, but with a full length, high sided and loaded trailer?
I guess there’s a certain amount of truth in this. You weren’t properly prepared back then which is why they brought in the driving test’s minimum requirement for a four over four. To prepare the driver for what goes on in the real world. The real world now is changing to autos. But there will always be a few manuals out there so why not leave the test as it is?
I think one of the reasons for the change is because training schools often buy secondhand trucks and they’re finding it more difficult to buy manuals with range change and this will only get worse as more auto’s come onto the secondhand market.
It’s easy for old timers to knock the test, but I don’t think any test, especially one you can pass with a few weeks training will prepare you for a job. When I did mine I certainly wasn’t prepared for the job, that I learnt by doing the job making mistakes, and at least I was working with my brother, so I had somebody to offer advice and point me in the right direction.
I feel right sorry for some poor bugger who signs up with an agency and gets sent to some mega logistics company, is given a set of keys, tonnes of paperwork and told get on with it.
All this form filling and box ticking is no substitute for a company taking time to show a new driver the ropes.
I remember reading the Hornblower books set in the time that was the end of the sailing ship era.The old salts bemoaned the steam tugs saying that they sounded the death knell for seaman ship as they knew it.Auto transmissions have came on a lot in the last few years.
alamcculloch:
I think that manuals will be phased out in the next 5 years.If they cost about the same then why choose old technology?
Because some drivers with a manual are more economic than other drivers with autos.
It isn’t cost effective to run a fleet of manuals when 1 out of 10 of your drivers is [zb] hot with a manual getting 10mpg, and the rest are struggling to get over 5mpg.
I love driving manuals when I’m on the spanners. I had a heavy hauler in with a boost leak, so I took it for a run at 60 tonnes. Nothing beats clutch kicking to go up through all your split gears and then feeling a sense of accomplishment once you’re in 12th crushing on the limiter. Then when I’m out in my wagon I just plop my elbows on the armrests and hold on, cruising past everyone.
You can’t beat a good old manual to feed your ego, but at the end of the day I’d rather sit back and relax whilst I’m down the road.
Also, as switchlogic might tell you. Volvos big 750 is only available in auto so why give up Swedish pulling power for an ego stick?!
alamcculloch:
I think that manuals will be phased out in the next 5 years.If they cost about the same then why choose old technology?
Because some drivers with a manual are more economic than other drivers with autos.
that’s a good point when you think back as to main reason why auto’s became popular in the first place
a good driver with a manual can produce excellent mpg (the main problem is the shortage of good drivers)
a poor driver with an auto can be made to look average !
