TM-CPC isn’t likely to change any time soon, TM refreshers are all different - I bet Beverly Bell runs hers very differently than I do 
She has written-work group-exercises. DCPC is going to change, so assuming you’re not yet ready to retire, next time you could choose the short (less than half a day) pass-or-fail test(s) option, which should be comfortably under £100
Guess what happens to the new start’s credit rating when they try to apply for credit to meet the financial standing requirement instead of the cold cash reserve required and which obviously defeats the object of it.If it’s ever needed the interest payments then become another expense to pay for added to the depreciation/maintenance/fuel killers.
When actually a decent factoring arrangement for quick payments and insurance for bad debts would be more useful.Together with accepting references from decent contractors regarding work and payments instead of such an arcaich arbitrary obstacle that is actually likely to have the opposite effect of penny pinching on kit to keep the required cash sitting doing nothing.
I agree with Rob it’s a minefield and sea of sharks but for different reasons and no different to all the risks of starting up any type of business.
Rob everything that you describe in terms of financial pressures at home also applies to employed drivers.If anything not having a mortgage to pay for or a family at home to clothe and feed ‘should’ have been expected to be taken into account by the TC in terms of the financial standing requirement.
I’ve described at least two contractors who were anything but sharks to work for there were others like ‘Ferrymasters’ , TOE etc etc ?.
I probably could have helped my parents pay off the house a lot sooner or even pay off one of my own with the terms and work on offer.
All those subbies pulling trailers around Europe weren’t doing it because it paid them worse than driving for the council or night trunking.
The chance to find out for sure would have been good but the zb TC and O licencing said no.
Owner Driver on tippers just don’t see the point.
Please do thrill me with your (no doubt extensive) experience as a TM or as someone who helps other people get their O-licence approved (from what you’ve already said, I’m confident that is zero).
Fortunately, those in the OTC are smart enough to know that a large wad of actual physical cash money is not required in this modern age.
quote: Carryfast:…
‘‘Rob everything you describe in terms of financial pressure at home also applies to employed drivers’’
Hmm not so sure if in the same way.
The risks taken taking the plunge to be an owner driver does not come anywhere near taking a job…you aint putting your home on the line for starters.
If your job goes tits up you get another, if your business goes the same way, there are much higher and serious consequences.
Not a good experience, especially as if in my case, it was a knock on effect of others going bust,.so although I take responsibility for it, not entitely my own fault…maybe other than stupidly trusting people.
The financial pressure at home comes about because of the investment in the first place, late (and non) payments, and the running costs, that need to be met irtespective of payments.
With a job, on the whole you have the relative security of guaranteed wages…all entirely different to being an owner driver, in an apples compared to oranges way.
So maybe up to a point it does apply, but in a very different context.
Again, I’m speaking from experience in both scenarios, …hence my opinions of not advising anybody to become a driver today, let alone (and especially) an owner driver.
As usual the resident “expert in everything” knows more about it than everyone, even the blokes who have been there, done that and got the tee shirt. If life and transport was really as easy as it is in Carryfast’s fantasy world, why did he fail as an employed driver? As he wasn’t able to succeed in that endeavor, there was no hope for him as an owner driver, despite his daydreams telling him otherwise.
Ah, but it was a conspiracy: the Goverment’s O-licencing system and the enforcement of it by the TC (who, it goes without saying, knows less about his job than our resident expert-in-everything).
CF is a living example of the bad workman blaming his tools
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@carryfast
When actually a decent factoring arrangement
Once again Carryfast comes up trumps. There is no such thing as a decent factoring arrangement-once you’re in you’re in and it is virtually impossible to get out. You should only factor your invoices NEVER. once you let someone sit on their arris and take 10 or 15% of your money you might as well quit-you’ve obviously got the wrong business model.
Also, CF is ignoring the fact that a new business has no “accounts receivable” to factor 
By definition factoring means up front payment for as yet unpaid invoices and/or bad debt admittedly for a considerable percentage of the outstanding payment.
A lot safer than using the equity in your house to cover it instead.Which is obviously the likely outcome of the O licence financial standing requirement assuming anyone takes that risk.
So a system designed to make prospective new starts take the worst possible financial route as opposed to accepting a decent factoring arrangement put on the table.
I think you’ve described exactly where and how I couldn’t meet that level of required financial commitment I didn’t have any house equity to use as collateral for credit for a new start.So in answer to Zac’s comments I approach a lender for the required credit to meet it and the lender says what’s it for and what collateral have you got as security I say none and I need it as security for the financial reserve needed to start up a haulage firm.Not only does the prospective lender decline the business ‘opportunity’ he marks my card for any further credit or credit enquiry by smashing my credit rating especially in the case of the multiple failed attempts.
To be fair to the industry our next door neighbour ran a successful printing business but which ran into cash flow issues.Which he used the equity in his house as security in an attempt to solve without telling his wife.
It all ended in the worst possible way.Luckily the mortgage lender waived the outstanding payments to prevent his then widow being evicted and thrown on the streets.
If you start using factoring you would probably looking for new customers.
They will pay your invoices within a couple of days and then hound your customers to death from day one.
We had used the same tyre supplier for a number of years ( local company and our sole supplier for a mixed fleet of 27, mainly 6 & 8 wheel tippers)
We would pay regularly between 30 - 60 days, he decided to factor his invoicing.
The finance co paid him two days after invoicing and would then be straight on the phone to his customers, like us, demanding immediate payment.
The average credit time in the construction trade is 60 - 90 days so you will see the problem.
It got so bad we threatened to change suppliers, I think he eventually stopped using factoring.
If the client does not pay the factored invoice, the factoring company will then chase the entity to which it advanced the money.
If the rates can sustain a 15~20% straight off the top, they are not competitive and without doubt will be undercut, if they were ever payed at all, in Carryfast fantasy land.
Your problem Carryfast, is you have never had to accept responsibility or face reality.
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Look CF mate,.I aint prepared to go into the gory details of my downfall when running a small business, other than maybe I had dodgy advice off a bad accountant, and I was young and a tad naive…again no excuse, entirely my own fault.
Suffice to say I did not actively or voluntarily put my house up for anything, I had no choice, ‘they’ came and took it off me.
I think you’re wasting your time mate. He’s not on the same planet as us.
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Regardless of the details Rob the fact is I wasn’t competing for my council driving job or night trunking with loads owner drivers ditching their units en masse to get out of the international traction and haulage business.
The choice seems clear enough factor out late or bad debt.
Or subsidise it yourself.Often obviously based on your own property being used and possibly taken as security.
Note the reference to specifically factoring out late or bad debt not every bleedin invoice.
As I said the O licencing system is putting pressure on new starts to make that worst possible choice, or stopping those without it, with the ridiculous financial ‘reserve’ requirement.
Bearing in mind it’s clearly all about handling late or bad debts not there for an investment or fun.
Refer you to my reply to Rob.Owner driver is like anything else.There are downsides and pitfalls regarding anything employed or self employed regardless of business sector.
The O licencing financial requirements just adds to them not alleviates them.
At the end of the day I never saw any international owner drivers abandoning the job to do UK work as a council driver or night trunking, or for that matter drive a refuse bulker/tipper.
NOT acceptable to the TC. You might potentially scrape by with an invoice finance agreement, but in this case YOU need to collect the debt, not sell the debt on to someone else. And as said before, OP would be a new operator so would not have payments waiting to be collected.
C’est des testicules! Security is not a necessary requirement for FS if you’re using a credit card (personal card for an owner-driver)
Noting that you’re ignoring what has been said that this would not be acceptable to the TC, nor would a new operator (ie OP) have any outstanding bills that hadn’t been paid
Hoden, Testikels, Varlata, Tezi dume
Whichever way you want to say it, you’re talking ball-ox
The OTC doesn’t want every Tom, Richard, or Harry who can lay his hands on a vehicle, running around without the ability to show he can maintain it.
The choice seems clear enough factor out late or bad debt.
Never come across a factoring system where you could pick and choose which invoices you’re factoring-it’s all or nothing.
I preferred to pick and choose my customers-usually by word of mouth from other O/Ds. Any habitual late payers didn’t have the privilege of using me-or-if their work suited me ie to get me where I wanted to be their bills went up by 10 or 15% to cover the late payment.
As for using my house as security I was lucky enough to have savings in place to cover the financial requirements at start up and that is where they stayed for the 15 years I was an O/D-perhaps I was lucky, perhaps I was more aware of the pitfalls having been in the industry for15 years or more before hand.