newmercman:
Don’t ask me, I rarely do 13hrs driving and I am now sitting typing this 13hrs after parking up last night and I haven’t pulled the curtains back yet lol
Lol thanks
What I am saying is that you don’t actually need to take a full 10 hours off duty before starting again and therefore the 14 hour rule does not apply.
I can give you a recent example of how the 8 hours sleeper worked… On Wednesday I had a 23.00 appointment at Ben & Jerry’s in St Albans VT, I left Yonkers at 14.00 giving myself 9 hours to take my time and get there, I had it worked out to deliver then go home, which is 2 hours south of St Albans and take 10 hours, after getting to about 70 miles up I-87 I got a call saying they had full tanks and could I deliver at 06.00 next day, after getting the call I had thought of stopping on the way up instead but at my house the snow and ice would mean there was a chance of getting stuck and waking people up at 2.30am didn’t appeal to me so I went all the way up, I arrived in St Albans at 21.00 and went in sleeper mode meaning I could start again at 05.00 and get the 8 hours in, I started after the 8 and drove round to B&J’s, although this was way over the 14 hours without a full 10 hours off, it gave me 4.5 hours driving and 5.5 hours duty, I left B&J’s and went home, instead of taking 2 hours I then took the full 10 off.
My point is that using this method you can actually just have 8 hours off provided you start the 8 hours with time still available. I didn’t need to take just the 2 hours.
Pat Hasler:
What I am saying is that you don’t actually need to take a full 10 hours off duty before starting again and therefore the 14 hour rule does not apply.
The 14 hour rule always applies. 2+8 or a straight 10 off are the same thing, they reset the 14 hour window. A full 10 hours off means you don’t have to keep track of anything on a rolling 24, an 2+8 means you have to take the two off during shift 2 before arriving at the point in which 24 hours have elapsed since taking the 2 hours the previous day. None of this changes the 14 hour window though. If you start at 6am this morning, you’re still not able to go beyond 8pm tonight regardless of whether you’ve had 8 or 10 off last night, or whether you have two off during the day or you don’t. 8pm is your limit either way. I think you’re confusing the 14 hour window with the 10 hour rest period, which can be gotten around so long as you do as I’ve said in my last few posts using the split sleeper method on a rolling 24 hour reference period.
newmercman:
Don’t ask me, I rarely do 13hrs driving and I am now sitting typing this 13hrs after parking up last night and I haven’t pulled the curtains back yet lol
I can do the odd 13 now and then but I certainly wouldn’t want to be doing it more than once or twice a week and preferably not at all. My biggest issue is my time off though, for me 10 hours is an absolute minimum and I’m certainly not one of those who moans about having to take so much time off. I don’t just drive and sleep, I want time to wind down, to eat, have a shower, watch tv or go on the internet and then have 7 hours or so sleep. You’re not going to be doing that on 8 hours off. If I’m going home for the night I always try and have 12 off, and my job usually allows for it thankfully.
If I have to have just 8 off in the name of progress, as in getting through Toronto or NYC etc before the traffic then I’ll make an exception but I really dislike doing so.
Pat Hasler:
.
I can give you a recent example of how the 8 hours sleeper worked… On Wednesday I had a 23.00 appointment at Ben & Jerry’s in St Albans VT, I left Yonkers at 14.00 giving myself 9 hours to take my time and get there, I had it worked out to deliver then go home, which is 2 hours south of St Albans and take 10 hours, after getting to about 70 miles up I-87 I got a call saying they had full tanks and could I deliver at 06.00 next day, after getting the call I had thought of stopping on the way up instead but at my house the snow and ice would mean there was a chance of getting stuck and waking people up at 2.30am didn’t appeal to me so I went all the way up, I arrived in St Albans at 21.00 and went in sleeper mode meaning I could start again at 05.00 and get the 8 hours in, I started after the 8 and drove round to B&J’s, although this was way over the 14 hours without a full 10 hours off, it gave me 4.5 hours driving and 5.5 hours duty, I left B&J’s and went home, instead of taking 2 hours I then took the full 10 off.
My point is that using this method you can actually just have 8 hours off provided you start the 8 hours with time still available. I didn’t need to take just the 2 hours.
Was your 14:00 departure from Yonkers when you logged on duty for that day and began your 14 hour window? or had you started earlier that day and sat in Yonkers off duty for two or more hours which itself gave you the opportunity to have an 8 hour break when you booked off at the end of the shift in question? You cannot have an 8 hour rest unless you’ve had 2 hour block during the preceding shift, ie some time on Wednesday at or before Yonkers. That two hours, plus the 8 hours you had off at St Albans are your 10 hours needed to reset the 14 hour window. As I’ve said a 2 hours in the day and an 8 at the end of shift are the same thing as a full 10 at the end of shift, with the exception of having to pay back the 2 hours durin the next shift before 24 hours have passed so you always have 10 hours showing in any 24 hour period.
You have not extended or driven beyond a 14 hour window, you started a new 14 hour window because your 8 hour rest in addition to a two hour qualifying period on Wednesday added up to 10 hours. If you started at 5am and your log said you had 5.5 hours of duty before having to stop for two hours, that would be 10:30am. That means the previous day (Wednesday in Yonkers) you were off duty between 10:30 and 12:30 which makes you eligible for a split sleeper rest period, needing only 8 hours to add up to a total of 10 hours and thus give you new 14 hour window when you started at 5am, so long as you paid back the two hours by 10:30am on Thursday to maintain a continuous flow of 10 hours off in any 24 hour period.
Are you following me? You have not extended or by passed anything to do with a 14 hour window, your combinations of rest have allowed you to take less than 10 hours off en-block at St Albans and start a new 14 hour window because 2+8 = 10.
Pat Hasler:
What I am saying is that you don’t actually need to take a full 10 hours off duty before starting again and therefore the 14 hour rule does not apply.
I can give you a recent example of how the 8 hours sleeper worked… On Wednesday I had a 23.00 appointment at Ben & Jerry’s in St Albans VT, I left Yonkers at 14.00 giving myself 9 hours to take my time and get there, I had it worked out to deliver then go home, which is 2 hours south of St Albans and take 10 hours, after getting to about 70 miles up I-87 I got a call saying they had full tanks and could I deliver at 06.00 next day, after getting the call I had thought of stopping on the way up instead but at my house the snow and ice would mean there was a chance of getting stuck and waking people up at 2.30am didn’t appeal to me so I went all the way up, I arrived in St Albans at 21.00 and went in sleeper mode meaning I could start again at 05.00 and get the 8 hours in, I started after the 8 and drove round to B&J’s, although this was way over the 14 hours without a full 10 hours off, it gave me 4.5 hours driving and 5.5 hours duty, I left B&J’s and went home, instead of taking 2 hours I then took the full 10 off.
My point is that using this method you can actually just have 8 hours off provided you start the 8 hours with time still available. I didn’t need to take just the 2 hours.
It’s easy to explain, a break of 8 hrs extends your 14 hrs work window, each break less than 8 hrs does not. If you take the 8 hrs break you will have the remaining on duty and drive hrs available till your 14 hrs window ends.
You have always only 14 hrs plus 8 hour break is 22 hrs total, than you have to take another 2 hrs (or more), this will move your new starting point to the end of your first break (end of the 8 hour break). You can take more than 8 hrs to extend your 14, as soon as you have 10 hrs completed a new 14 hrs window starts.
If you take the 2 hrs (or more) break first it doesn’t extend your 14 but after another 8 hrs break it will move your new starting point of the 14 to the end of the 2 hr (or more) break.
The 8+2 rule is not the same as a 10 hr break!
An example:
Left my home last week on Monday
on duty and driving at 13:22
off duty at the shipper at 19:37
on duty again at 01:11 (break of 5:04)
off duty and sleeper at 03:32
on duty and driving again at 11:41 (break of 8:09)
off duty and sleeper at 22:55 (had still about 15 minutes on duty left)
took then a 10 hr break and was back to a normal schedule
I don’t like driving in the night at these times, but so I could leave Los Angeles in the night and avoided the big mess in the morning. I didn’t need my full 14 and 11 for the next day so I started after the 8 hr break.
I’m glad that the e-log did the math 
(Forgot to mention, my e-log is on Central Time, the actual (local) times were 2 hrs earlier)
I have used 2 x 8 hours breaks in a row without the extra 2 hours.
Pat Hasler:
I have used 2 x 8 hours breaks in a row without the extra 2 hours.
Never tried that but will tomorrow. Drive 2 hrs to my delivery, another 2 hrs to pickup, take an 8 hr break, pickup in the evening, then drive a bit into the night, take another 8. Will see whats left, if I can’t make it to the yard in Omaha I’ll take a 10 instead of the second 8.
Made more than 4000 miles since I left home on Monday last week, today on recap, The last two days only 5.5 and 6.5 hrs left on the 70 per day, stopped yesterday with 15 min left and today with 5 min left on my 70.
It’s definitely easier with e-logs 
Couldn’t take my 8 hr at the shipper, my plan was to be there at 11:00, pickup appointment was 19:00. Due to the winter storm and blizzard in Indiana I was there short after 11, after I had my lunch I wanted to sleep a bit when I suddenly noticed a movement in the trailer (I was immediately at the dock after I arrived there). About 45 minutes later a guy came thru the snowstorm to my truck knocking: “You’re done!!” What a surprise!
After some problems sliding axles in the snow I drove thru the yard to the office to get my papers. Got them and wanted to leave, but was stuck in the deep snow. Took me about 15 min to get the truck out and then I left in the heaviest snowfall and winter storm I had this winter. The roads to get to the I-80 were not plowed and it was a fun to drive in 10 inches of deep snow. As soon as I was in Illinois the worst was over. So no taking 2x8 hrs, instead I’ll take a 12 hr break now and leave tomorrow morning
Obviously when I wanted to use an 8 hour sleeper break yesterday it didn’t work well for me, I had used too many hours before going into sleeper mode, after 8 hours I checked and I only gained 1 hour and 45 minutes, not worth it so I stayed for the full 10.
Pat Hasler:
Obviously when I wanted to use an 8 hour sleeper break yesterday it didn’t work well for me, I had used too many hours before going into sleeper mode, after 8 hours I checked and I only gained 1 hour and 45 minutes, not worth it so I stayed for the full 10.
The 8 hr break only extends your 14, if you have used 9:15 driving time you will only have left 1:45 after the break. Same with total hours, if you used 13 you will only have left 1 hour on duty time. If you can fit in a 2 hr break first, your new starting point for the new 14 would be at the end of your 2 hr break after you take the 8 hr.
I always try to get a 2 hr at a shipper or receiver (if it takes a bit longer) so I can use the 8 hr break if it’s necessary. The 2 hr break must not be on sleeper, it can also be off duty, but the 8 hr break must be logged as sleeper.
Sometimes it helps to be at a customer on time, with a 10 I would be late. Used the split sleeper berth provision now several times and I love it with the e-log
Another advantage with elogs is crossing the border. As some of the comments here are from Canadian residents and the hours of service in the frozen north, I love the way it automatically changes from US to Can rules, that extra 2 hours driving just appears and on return even if I have used the full 14 hours of US time, when it changes back to US rules it still allows me the extra time, I have no idea why ?
Pat Hasler:
Another advantage with elogs is crossing the border. As some of the comments here are from Canadian residents and the hours of service in the frozen north, I love the way it automatically changes from US to Can rules, that extra 2 hours driving just appears and on return even if I have used the full 14 hours of US time, when it changes back to US rules it still allows me the extra time, I have no idea why ?
I’ve crossed the border to Canada only one time after driving here in the States. Took a 34 hr reset in Canada and when I crossed the border to the States I got my full 70 hrs minus the hrs I drove that day (34 vs. 36 hrs rule).
Never been back in Canada since 2013 and have no intention to go there anymore…
Don’t know why you have more than the 14 available when you cross back to the States 
The first time I crossed in a situation where I knew I had used all but 10 minutes of Canadian HOS I got to the border and logged off duty before it changed just to stop me going into an infringement situation, it was less than half a mile to the nasty truck stop at Champlain NY, I had no idea about the extra time being allowed until a later trip.
Pat Hasler:
it was less than half a mile to the nasty truck stop at Champlain NY, I had no idea about the extra time being allowed until a later trip.
Which one? I stopped for diesel and a shower at the Irving truckstop in Champlain about two weeks ago and it wasn’t that bad. I saw there was a Mobil truck stop on the other side of the 87 opposite the McDonald’s which also has truck parking.
I like that Irving stop, They have amazing Pizza, I have spent several nights there, I am talking about the other pile of crap at the very last exit LOL.
The other Mobil stop you mentioned cook fresh breakfasts etc but they hand them to you on paper plates with plastic forks and if you ask for a knife they just stare at you with a lost expression, I tried it once and all she said was “Where are you from ?”
“Civilisation, it’s down the highway about 100 miles” I said
Did two 8’s in a row again this week. On Tuesday morning running up 91 just north of New Haven CT and the red check engine light came on, I stopped and saw it had lost coolant to bellow the sensor, I found a leak from the radiator, I called dispatch and the kid said “I’ll call a tow truck” 
“Noooo, I am about half a mile from exit 9, there’s a little fuel stop there, I will top off now and get there and buy some more”
I drove to the stop, bought two extra cans and headed on my way to B&J in Waterbury VT, it lost about half a gallon. Next day the truck was booked into Albany for a PM anyway. Wednesday morning they got a new radiator, I went on a 8 hour sleeper break while the fitted it and ran down to NYC to originally take another 2 hours, I arrived at out NYC yard at 7.00pm, if I took 2 hours I thought it would give me more than the time I needed to get to Bethlehem PA for the 7.00am appointment, it didn’t, it only gave me to 5.00 am so I decided to take a full 10 hours but after I had slept and woke at 3.00 am I just checked and found I had been given 10.5 hours so off I set, stopped for fuel and a shower at the pilot on exit 7 of 78, arrived in Bethlehem at 5.30, backed into the spot and hit the off duty spot again for 2 hours, that gave me until 5.00pm, I ran to Fairless Hills PA , hooked to a loaded tank for B& J again and got to Milford CT for the night.
So two 8 hour sleeper breaks in a row is fully legal, elog said so.
I’m liking mine the more I use it, I find I can max my hours out every day, plan my day ahead and it keeps me legal too. I wouldn’t want to go back on paper logs now if I’m honest.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Having never used or even seen an electronic log, do they record your speed ?
I’ve got a mate at H&R that was one of 5 that originally tested the electronic log for them and his was on the qualcom, are they all on qualcom or are there stand alone electronic log machines as well ?
What happens when you get to a scale and they call you inside and want to see it ?
neilg14:
Having never used or even seen an electronic log, do they record your speed ?
I’ve got a mate at H&R that was one of 5 that originally tested the electronic log for them and his was on the qualcom, are they all on qualcom or are there stand alone electronic log machines as well ?
What happens when you get to a scale and they call you inside and want to see it ?
We have Shaw in our trucks so I’m guessing there’s a few different systems available. The units are wired into the truck main ecu allowing it to monitor speeds, engine running time etc and I’m guessing ours have some type of shock sensor too as if you have to brake sharply or if you strike an animal etc you can send a five minute report back to wherever your data is stored in case it’s needed for legal/insurance purposes. If we get stopped at a scale all we need is an email address from the DOT guys and we can send them our last 14 days of logs