rightly you admit that you did not check the trailer brake, however you are legitmately entitled to make an insurance claim, did you go to the hospital have Xrays? your supervisor being in charge asked you if you was ok, however her should of done a report for you being injured did he witness the injury did he see the cut did anybody actually witness the accident, have you been given a reason to why they said you lied??
You have the right to go for unfair dismissal, however have to lodge claim within 3 months I suggest you do it now have you used the company appeal proceedure ■■
Get a lawyer now some will take it up on a no win no fee if they think you have a case, they give free assessments 6 may say you have no claim 4 will say yes dont give up if all else fails try ACAS they should be able to put you on to someone to maybe help.
Am I right in saying that an insurance claim against the company can only go ahead if the company have been deemed negligent and not where an employee has failed to follow safe procedures ?
ROG:
Am I right in saying that an insurance claim against the company can only go ahead if the company have been deemed negligent and not where an employee has failed to follow safe procedures ?
I would imagine so.
The accident was the fault of the OP…and proper procedure wasn’t followed.
More chance of seeing the Pope in Mothercare than successfully suing the company I’d say…
The company would more than likely get a bollocking, but I doubt any injuries would be compensated as there appears no evidence (other than the OP’s word) that injuries actually occurred. No hospital visit, no record of it officially etc.
A decent solicitor would rip such a case to shreds…
There is more to this than we currently are aware I would say…
Disclosure of CCTV doesn’t apply on private property, only if the camera covers a public place.
The police wouldn’t be interested, it’s a civil matter. you could go to the HSE and see what they make of it, but at the end of the day, it would have been up to you to do a couple of tug tests once you’ve backed under the trailer, if you’ve got the relevant licence, you will know that you should have done that.
It’s pretty irrelevant what happened if you get in contact with ACAS they will tell you if you have a case or not. All I will say is from my experience being on the side of sacking people. The company HAS to PROVE that you lied or falsified statements. They can do this with either quite a few statements that go against what you have said or with video evidence. They can NOT dismiss you as they BELIEVE your lying. I’ll say again they must PROVE it.
maestegboy:
Just wanted to know have the company broke any laws?
Any ex coppers out there.
I can’t be sure about breaking some but they’re using one to obfuscate the truth. There’s no legitimate DP reason why you shouldn’t see the video unless the video identifies other individuals who have not given permission for their likenesses to be disclosed.
Bit of editing usually sorts it, or the parts of the video which are pertinent to your accident can be recovered from the complete footage.
So that’s a lie.
Regarding H+S etc. I’ve no idea but I would think any degree of cover-up, accident book or otherwise is cause for concern.
NewLad:
It’s pretty irrelevant what happened if you get in contact with ACAS they will tell you if you have a case or not. All I will say is from my experience being on the side of sacking people. The company HAS to PROVE that you lied or falsified statements. They can do this with either quite a few statements that go against what you have said or with video evidence. They can NOT dismiss you as they BELIEVE your lying. I’ll say again they must PROVE it.
HTH
I can tell you what happens at an industrial tribunal (IT) because I have been through one in 2005
The IT only looks at the procedures used to fire you not the evidence
The defining caselaw is based on the BHS ruling where the high court ruled that evidence cannot be looked into at an IT
I lost my case because of this - the company procedures were found to be correct BUT the IT stated that I was a very credible witness
That was as far as they could go in saying that although they believed I was telling the truth, Their remit did not allow them to consider it … seriously
discoman:
rightly you admit that you did not check the trailer brake, however you are legitmately entitled to make an insurance claim,
Really? So even though the OP ■■■■■■ up he should be compensated for what exactly and out of who’s pocket… Its about bloody time people start taking reasonability for themselves instead of trying to blame it on someone else… Not surprised you got the sack OP perharps if you stood like a man and said “I messed up”, they’d have kept you on but instead you tried to blame someone else and don’t sit there and give it “ive got all the licenses”, then turn round and they didn’t give you any training! Not surprising companies take on poles is it!
discoman:
rightly you admit that you did not check the trailer brake, however you are legitmately entitled to make an insurance claim,
Really? So even though the OP [zb] up he should be compensated for what exactly and out of who’s pocket… Its about bloody time people start taking reasonability for themselves instead of trying to blame it on someone else… Not surprised you got the sack OP perharps if you stood like a man and said “I messed up”, they’d have kept you on but instead you tried to blame someone else and don’t sit there and give it “ive got all the licenses”, then turn round and they didn’t give you any training! Not surprising companies take on poles is it!
Your opinion would typify why we do need training, and the reason we have the clear legislation we already have as to who is responsible for the training. If we where to follow your logic, then everyone should “just know their job”. People who know what they are supposed to be doing don’t usually ■■■■ up when it can hurt them. They usually get it wrong when they don’t know what they’re doing in my experience. If they don’t know what they’re doing its a clear abuse of the PUWER legislation. (You can google that yourself).
If i was the OP, having gleaned the info from this thread i would write to the company and suggest that any failing on my part was down to their failure to adhere to their obligations under the PUWER regulations, and that i will now report the issue (having recieved further advice) to theHSE for failure to adhere to the RIDDOR regs. That would start an investigation, and would lead to members of staff being questioned. Or i might offer a one off payment to be recieved by me in lieu of such actions in order for them to sort out their own affairs, minus me reporting the whole incident to the HSE.
Thats what i’d do anyway, but i’m not the OP. I could understand your attitude to what he’s done if he’d been trained in what to do and had neglected it, but reading through i don’t think thats the case. Infact it looks like with hindsight he’s found out he’s ■■■■■■ up and held his hands up. But he’s not on his own, like i’ve pointed out.
When you say its not suprising companies take on Poles…i’m thinking this is in a perjorative sense, but to whom ? Poles, Companies or UK employees? Do you think Poles get trained better, or maybe they’re less likley to complain if things go wrong, or maybe you think companies here don’t have to train Poles? You don’t make it clear what you mean?
The supervisor was moving hgv,s around the yard just to let everybody know he has no licence and has been told by big boss he’s not allowed to drive them,perhaps that’s why the CCTV footage has gone missing.
Will engage solicitor ASAP .thanks for advice will post any. News
Don’t get me wrong im all for training but in this case did they company really need to provide it, if he’s got a license then he should know what he’s doing because he’s already been trained and tested. The point im making is people need to take more reasonability for themselves instead of blaming someone else then trying to earn a few quid out of it.
From my experience of running my parents business poles don’t cause trouble like the English do, wouldn’t try blaming the previous guy who dropped the trailer and if they got the sack they’d just get a new job, but instead the OP is now going to cause this company a load of hassle when its him that’s ■■■■■■ it up, like I said, if he had of just held his hands up and came in bright and early the next day, maybe a warning and that would of been it.
Saaamon:
Don’t get me wrong im all for training but in this case did they company really need to provide it, if he’s got a license then he should know what he’s doing because he’s already been trained and tested. The point im making is people need to take more reasonability for themselves instead of blaming someone else then trying to earn a few quid out of it.
I can’t speak for the OP, but in my experience you come across a lot of myths, and even here you can get wrong advice, or misadvise. You could take a statement like…do i need to apply a trailer brake? Someone might say , no you don’t modern trailer have an automatic one. Thats its the trailer won’t move. And they’d be right. What no one’s saying or asking is will the trailer move when i connect the airline ? Yes it will. Not everyone is going to know this from the off, they might assume the trailer brake is on until they take it off. I worked for Walkers crisps, and they where ■■■■ over this stuff. I was not only inducted and shown what to do and this was years ago, if i pulled up and coupled to a trailer without checking the brake there was usually some one like a trainer or a security guard who would report me as a near miss accident because i never checked it. That sort of regime makes you not do it a second time. I’m not saying i liked it, but i never hurt myself.
Saaamon:
From my experience of running my parents business poles don’t cause trouble like the English do, wouldn’t try blaming the previous guy who dropped the trailer and if they got the sack they’d just get a new job, but instead the OP is now going to cause this company a load of hassle when its him that’s [zb] it up, like I said, if he had of just held his hands up and came in bright and early the next day, maybe a warning and that would of been it.
I’ve never really generalised about peoples race or culture, if i did i’d believe all scousers are thieves, Southerners are hard working, Romanians and Bulgarians are the salt of the earth and Poles are the saviour of us all. As it is i find people are just people. If i was to generalise i’d shove Hadrians wall and the EU border to just about level with Stoke on trent !! But not without doing a risk assesment first
ROG:
Was the ‘tug test’ done twice when you connected up ?
What difference would it have made to the outcome whether it was or wasn’t done?
(apart from being seen to comply with procedure).
This isn’t about a trailer coming off the 5th wheel. The OP states he checked and the pin was correctly coupled. At the time of the tug test, the trl brakes would have been on as the red line wasn’t yet connected.
You don’t need an HGV license to work as a yard shunter or drive HGV’s in the yard, unless it is company policy.
I regularly read HSE accident investigation results. Having read the OP’s report, I think the HSE would have a field day with this. (against the co.)
It has been suggested that if taken to task in the correct manner, the employer may make an offer in order to avoid an HSE investigation. If this offer came about, the OP should not accept the first figure on the table.
ROG:
Was the ‘tug test’ done twice when you connected up ?
What difference would it have made to the outcome whether it was or wasn’t done?
Perhaps I read it wrong but I thought the OP said the trailer came forward and trapped him - that would not happen if it was connected correctly … yes?
ROG:
Was the ‘tug test’ done twice when you connected up ?
What difference would it have made to the outcome whether it was or wasn’t done?
Perhaps I read it wrong but I thought the OP said the trailer came forward and trapped him - that would not happen if it was connected correctly … yes?
I, too, am a little confused about that. If the pin was correctly engaged in the fifth wheel, how could you get squashed?
But surely if the accident had been recorded the resulting investigation could only have found gross negligence on the OPs part and he’d still be sacked but with an official record that can be shown to future employers looking for reference.
Whereas hearsay and rumours can’t.
Fridges sit very close to the cab. There isn’t much room to get in, a fat guy wouldn’t get in at all. When the trailer brakes are released most trailers lurch a bit, especially if not on level ground.
If he’d over shot the pin the trailer would have continued forward and squashed him, probably fatally.
maestegboy:
I was in severe pain when i got off the floor i found the trailor brake hadn,t been applied,one of the loaders
heard the loud noise and came to the door and asked me if i was ok.
Your fault.
Hooking trailers up…
CHECK THE PARK BRAKE IS APPLIED.
This is the very very first thing you do before anything else. You failed to do it and paid the penalty. And you’ve admitted you didn’t check either which has pretty much killed all chances of compensation.
As for any laws being broken, none have been broken by your company. There’s no point asking the police because no criminal offence has been committed.
).