How do you guys shows other work i.e. non driving — when non driving can be full days or even a week? At the moment i note times on manual tacho graphs i.e. date, start and finish time.
But just thinking should i be doing manual entries on digi card? That don’t seem practical and i dont even know if its possible to show other work for that long period. Or can you show what you have done between last card withdrawal and current re-insertion even if it is say a month? If so what mode would you show it as? other work for whole of the time?
Pops77:
How do you guys shows other work i.e. non driving — when non driving can be full days or even a week? At the moment i note times on manual tacho graphs i.e. date, start and finish time.
But just thinking should i be doing manual entries on digi card? That don’t seem practical and i dont even know if its possible to show other work for that long period. Or can you show what you have done between last card withdrawal and current re-insertion even if it is say a month? If so what mode would you show it as? other work for whole of the time?
What you’re doing is fine and 100% legal.
It is possible to do manual entries, but it’d probably take you about an hour due to the crappy menu system and having to do everything 1 at a time - you’d have to record your breaks too remember…
Personally, it wouldn’t be recorded, because it’s just too much hassle and none of anybody elses business, but I wouldn’t work myself into a grave, so if I was working all week, I’d probably have at least every other weekend off anyway.
I keep a diary, whish shows what days I’ve been driving, what days I’ve been doing my normal job, and what days I’ve had off totally (usually just weekends & BHs). I emailed VOSA to see if this would be acceptable in the event of a stop, and eventually got an email back saying that they weren’t prepared to say whether this was OK or not, and it woudl be down to the individual inspector on the day - leaving themselves nicely open in case their takings for the day are a bit under target I presume!
In addition to the diary, I’ve obviously also got any charts from the last 28 days and my digicard (although it’s never been used). Whether this would all pass muster, I really don’t know, but I don’t know what else I can do, short of having a continually running camera recording my every move (maybe shouldn’t suggest that - it might be the next thing from the gummint!)
I use Microsoft Outlook as my main diary and just keep a record of the hours I do driving work as well as other business appointments. I’ve been using this method for the past 10 years and it suits me. I’ve asked a VOSA inspector (who happened to be a customer of mine at the time, a few years ago), if this would be adequate & he said it was so I’ve stuck with it. Because I drive fairly infrequently at the moment it would be pointless me trying to keep track of things purely on my digicard/tachos.
Pops77:
How do you guys shows other work i.e. non driving — when non driving can be full days or even a week? At the moment i note times on manual tacho graphs i.e. date, start and finish time.
But just thinking should i be doing manual entries on digi card? That don’t seem practical and i dont even know if its possible to show other work for that long period. Or can you show what you have done between last card withdrawal and current re-insertion even if it is say a month? If so what mode would you show it as? other work for whole of the time?
You only need to record work done in the same week that you drive to EU regulations.
What you’re doing is legal and it’s also how VOSA say it should be done in their booklet Page 39 - GV262
I managed to have a chat with a reasonably amiable VOSA inspector who had stopped in our local Sainsbugs. I asked the exact same question as I’m a part time amateur. I use my casual employers time sheet to record my other job and carry the last half a dozen weeks with me whether I drove or not. His response was unless I ran into a totol jobsworth from his fine organisation then that would be ok. What he didn’t consider was how many jobsworth’s work for VOSA??!
peak_46:
I managed to have a chat with a reasonably amiable VOSA inspector who had stopped in our local Sainsbugs. I asked the exact same question as I’m a part time amateur. I use my casual employers time sheet to record my other job and carry the last half a dozen weeks with me whether I drove or not. His response was unless I ran into a totol jobsworth from his fine organisation then that would be ok. What he didn’t consider was how many jobsworth’s work for VOSA??!
That’s why I probably just wouldn’t bother recording anything. The less you give them, the less they can use against you.
VOSA: “tacho’s please drive”
Driver: “There you are sir…” hands digi card "and a lovely day it is too, don’t you agree?? I’ve not had much work, agencies … pfft, you know how it is "…
VOSA: “Thanks drive, I’m just going to kick this tyre over here on my way back to my brew”
Much better than
Driver: “I’ve got all this ■■■■■■■■ here to show you mr Vosa sir to show that I do other work but obey the rules” hands over 50 sheets of a4 and some analogue tacho’s 1 of which has a crease in it
VOSA: “tut tut tut…” does mechanic style breathe in whistle “well drive, there seems to be a problem that’s going to cost you more than you’ve earned today…”
I’ve often thought the same and being a bit of a newbie wasn’t sure what to do for the best. I always wondered what they could do to prove what I do outside of my driving employment but as I keep it legal I don’t have anything to hide. Does make you think though.
in the vosa rules and regs there is a copy of a drivers log sheet , I print out 4 of those and staple together and if driving taxi for the day just put in start and end of day , if on tacho just right down tacho on veh reg and start and finish time keep these on me when im driving along with any printouts I have done and any paper tachos as long I keep at least 4 weeks at a time and if no hgv work done then a line goes through that weeks sheet with no hgv work done , this was seen by a vosa bod and he told me is fine if I get stopped ,
When at ■■■■■■■■■ ltd, it was there policy that you carried with you a ‘gap letter’ signed by a manager to verify the gaps on your digi card. I refused, saying it was no ones business but my own and if I was holiday or whatever and if they needed proof they could contact my manager (I would gladly furnish the phone number) and they could confirm it with them. What a load of tosh, they’ll want us micro chipped next!! People should stop worrying and get on with living FFS!
fredthered:
When at [zb] ltd, it was there policy that you carried with you a ‘gap letter’ signed by a manager to verify the gaps on your digi card. I refused, saying it was no ones business but my own and if I was holiday or whatever and if they needed proof they could contact my manager (I would gladly furnish the phone number) and they could confirm it with them. What a load of tosh, they’ll want us micro chipped next!! People should stop worrying and get on with living FFS!
Sent from my iPhone using my right index finger!
That’s great and all but we got a prohibition while they called us about one of our my drivers for gap in records.
Jennie:
in the vosa rules and regs there is a copy of a drivers log sheet , I print out 4 of those and staple together and if driving taxi for the day just put in start and end of day , if on tacho just right down tacho on veh reg and start and finish time keep these on me when im driving along with any printouts I have done and any paper tachos as long I keep at least 4 weeks at a time and if no hgv work done then a line goes through that weeks sheet with no hgv work done , this was seen by a vosa bod and he told me is fine if I get stopped ,
jx
Could you send me a link to this drivers log sheet please? We currently use a RHA working time directive books, I get all the drivers to fill them out everyday and it will either co-inside with their Tacho records or cover them for the days they don’t have any.
I was informed that this would not suffice officially but vosa seem to be happy with the effort and have not questioned it when we have been pulled over.
I got pulled at Cobelfret, Immingham by VOSA. I work shifts and do the odd couple of days for a local O/D. VOSA man wanted to see manual cards for my non-driving working days. He also wanted to see a letter from the O/D to confirm I was just a casual/weekend driver. I had the above and he sent me on my way. I would say that you will need your charts for non driving days. I was told that a diary with days in is not enough. Tacho is a legal document and a diary won’t cut it.
Jennie:
in the vosa rules and regs there is a copy of a drivers log sheet , I print out 4 of those and staple together and if driving taxi for the day just put in start and end of day , if on tacho just right down tacho on veh reg and start and finish time keep these on me when im driving along with any printouts I have done and any paper tachos as long I keep at least 4 weeks at a time and if no hgv work done then a line goes through that weeks sheet with no hgv work done , this was seen by a vosa bod and he told me is fine if I get stopped ,
Could you send me a link to this drivers log sheet please? We currently use a RHA working time directive books, I get all the drivers to fill them out everyday and it will either co-inside with their Tacho records or cover them for the days they don’t have any.
I was informed that this would not suffice officially but vosa seem to be happy with the effort and have not questioned it when we have been pulled over.
fredthered:
When at [zb] ltd, it was there policy that you carried with you a ‘gap letter’ signed by a manager to verify the gaps on your digi card. I refused, saying it was no ones business but my own and if I was holiday or whatever and if they needed proof they could contact my manager (I would gladly furnish the phone number) and they could confirm it with them. What a load of tosh, they’ll want us micro chipped next!! People should stop worrying and get on with living FFS!
all depend from VOSA officers.
drivers can put in the sheets who he was workonk in warehouse 2 day,but realy was working 4 day.if some people work in warehouse or…,whea company have clock in,clock out machine .yes VOSA can check and ask about working hours from this company.but if drivers work as well in garages,contrction ot taxi drivers,who can check -how many hours was worked,what time start and finish.NOBODY
2.ALL DEPEND FROM vosa oficers.if one VOSA OFICERS STOP EVERY MONNT 200 LORRY and found example 30 mistakes in taxo or lorry condition.but another stop 200 lorry and found just 10 mistakes.what VOSA bosses will be think about this inspectors.■■?EVERY POLICE OFICCERS OR VOSA INSPECTORS wont show own perfomace.if he found not to many fault -no good him.and if he foynd to many fault -as well no good,because next month if he found a lot less .basicly any officers will be try keep same or simeral level.
What other profession has to account for their time when not working■■? IMO the onus is on them to prove I wasn’t on holiday/day off/at the clap clinic or whatever. If they want complete records they should make the digi tacho the only device that’s acceptable recording equipment and enforce retro fitting where necessary and also modify them to allow manual ‘block time’ entries. Then they can have all the info they desire.
Seems to me that any jobs worth VOSA geezer can make his or her own rules up as they go along. BB needs to get her finger out of her arse and sort it properly.
dominicpriestley:
I got pulled at Cobelfret, Immingham by VOSA. I work shifts and do the odd couple of days for a local O/D. VOSA man wanted to see manual cards for my non-driving working days. He also wanted to see a letter from the O/D to confirm I was just a casual/weekend driver. I had the above and he sent me on my way. I would say that you will need your charts for non driving days. I was told that a diary with days in is not enough. Tacho is a legal document and a diary won’t cut it.
Do you fill out the back of the Tacho card as a actual day? Or just date time and write ‘no driving’ for those days you aren’t driving but just working?
My guys struggle to spell their name right sometimes and filling in a blank Tacho with manual entries is not something they know how to even do! And with the amount of times they have a day off the lorry to work on site or drive a machine is actually quite frequent, meaning It would be a real ball ache for me and them!
They are both over 60 now and although very good drivers not easily taught new things… I couldn’t replace them easily as its very specialist work and they are trusted employees.
