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petition.parliament.uk/petitions/172382
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Well, there obviously isn’t a driver shortage or the wage would already be £15+ per hour. Why do people start these idiotic petitions?
Harry Monk:
Why do people start these idiotic petitions?
I wonder if certain external factors play a part?
peirre:
Harry Monk:
Why do people start these idiotic petitions?I wonder if certain external factors play a part?
Are they Imperial pints?
It’ll never happen, the rates just simply can’t tolerate it. Let’s say you’re paid straight through with no ot rates. That’s £225 for a 15 hour day plus a £25 night out. The rates would need at least a 30% increase. Don’t forget that this enhanced rate would also incur higher employers contributions for pensions and ni. I’m not saying I wouldn’t like to see it, just that it’s not practical. The only solution is to boycott the firms paying poor wages
OVLOV JAY:
It’ll never happen, the rates just simply can’t tolerate it. Let’s say you’re paid straight through with no ot rates. That’s £225 for a 15 hour day plus a £25 night out. The rates would need at least a 30% increase. Don’t forget that this enhanced rate would also incur higher employers contributions for pensions and ni. I’m not saying I wouldn’t like to see it, just that it’s not practical. The only solution is to boycott the firms paying poor wages
Lower rates put in by most hauliers are not subsidised by themselves, ie. by cutting back on co. cars etc for example.
They are subsidised by paying a less wage to a driver.
A haulage firm I know very well indeed, (who will remain nameless) do work for a co with their own trucks.
Said co pay proper wages to their drivers with proper pay structures, ie.time and a half over 40. The haulage firm in question do not, they pay a lower hourly rate with a small increase for overtime after 50 hours…
Guess who gets the most work because they can do it cheaper, their own drivers or the haulage co?
The whole system of haulage stinks, when a co. can put a rate in to do a cheaper job purely on the backs of their drivers. 
robroy:
OVLOV JAY:
It’ll never happen, the rates just simply can’t tolerate it. Let’s say you’re paid straight through with no ot rates. That’s £225 for a 15 hour day plus a £25 night out. The rates would need at least a 30% increase. Don’t forget that this enhanced rate would also incur higher employers contributions for pensions and ni. I’m not saying I wouldn’t like to see it, just that it’s not practical. The only solution is to boycott the firms paying poor wagesLower rates put in by most hauliers are not subsidised by themselves, ie. by cutting back on co. cars etc for example.
They are subsidised by paying a less wage to a driver.
A haulage firm I know very well indeed, (who will remain nameless) do work for a co with their own trucks.
Said co pay proper wages to their drivers with proper pay structures, ie.time and a half over 40. The haulage firm in question do not, they pay a lower hourly rate with a small increase for overtime after 50 hours…
Guess who gets the most work because they can do it cheaper, their own drivers or the haulage co?The whole system of haulage stinks, when a co. can put a rate in to do a cheaper job purely on the backs of their drivers.
I agree with you that the whole industry stinks, and I believe it needs a government minister, not just the catchall transport secretary. Root and branch clean out including setting minimum rates, to stop undercutting. Back to the days of jobs being done on a level of service, not a level of cost. The problem with expecting employers to subsidise poor rates with company cars and executive benefits etc, is nobody would set up if you can’t give yourself a better life than the employees. The reward is for their risk. You should know that mate, you lost your house after all, all your staff lost was their jobs
Radar19:
Are they Imperial pints?
I doubt that they’ll be metric pints 
OVLOV JAY:
robroy:
OVLOV JAY:
It’ll never happen, the rates just simply can’t tolerate it. Let’s say you’re paid straight through with no ot rates. That’s £225 for a 15 hour day plus a £25 night out. The rates would need at least a 30% increase. Don’t forget that this enhanced rate would also incur higher employers contributions for pensions and ni. I’m not saying I wouldn’t like to see it, just that it’s not practical. The only solution is to boycott the firms paying poor wagesLower rates put in by most hauliers are not subsidised by themselves, ie. by cutting back on co. cars etc for example.
They are subsidised by paying a less wage to a driver.
A haulage firm I know very well indeed, (who will remain nameless) do work for a co with their own trucks.
Said co pay proper wages to their drivers with proper pay structures, ie.time and a half over 40. The haulage firm in question do not, they pay a lower hourly rate with a small increase for overtime after 50 hours…
Guess who gets the most work because they can do it cheaper, their own drivers or the haulage co?The whole system of haulage stinks, when a co. can put a rate in to do a cheaper job purely on the backs of their drivers.
I agree with you that the whole industry stinks, and I believe it needs a government minister, not just the catchall transport secretary. Root and branch clean out including setting minimum rates, to stop undercutting. Back to the days of jobs being done on a level of service, not a level of cost. The problem with expecting employers to subsidise poor rates with company cars and executive benefits etc, is nobody would set up if you can’t give yourself a better life than the employees. The reward is for their risk. You should know that mate, you lost your house after all, all your staff lost was their jobs
Jay, I understand and am fully aware that the ‘risk’ is taken by the employer rather than the employee when starting a business.
The manufacturing co in question, that the haulage firm work for, I am sure do not sustain their successful business by gaining even more business from their competitors, by subsidising that undercut by paying their employees a lesser wage, than their competitors pay, thus creating an unlevel playing field.
If a firm is making a lucrative profit, surely a happier ship would be created with all the benefits that brings to both employee AND employer, if both parties get a bite of the cherry. 
I am also unfortunately aware this is real world stuff, and life is unfair, however it does not stop me getting ■■■■■■ off when it adversly affects me directly.
There IS a shortage of Home-grown clean licenced drivers prepared to work for less than £15ph now. Indeed, many of us will probably fit into that category.
This Christmas should prove interesting though, being the first following two voting “upsets” as it were…
Yards might be struggling to get drivers on agency, with all the agency bods booked out on the christmas runs for… top dollar dare I say?
Plenty of recruitment via agency going on paying well over £15ph right now. Supermarkets, Royal Mail, even the other courier firms…
SO: If all the agency staff are fully booked, and then some bod in a full time job WALKS OUT in the next few weeks? - Whoya gonna call?
“Lapsed Busters”? 
I Agree some of these petitions are a nonsense!
Its basically someone having a moan about their money/job which a lot of us do!
Its just generic so i guess includes everything from 7.5t and up?
Also makes claims that are not true.
I Can’t see how a minimum of £15ph could be possible across the whole haulage industry as some sectors just couldn’t afford to pay that or am i talking as much twaddle as the petition?
In most areas of haulage there simply is not the money to pay fantasy wages. Look at the net profit many hauliers make. It’s 2-3% of turnover in some cases, and what is even more worrying is that some of them seem to think that’s something to be proud of… 
It would be interesting to see where the petition starter thinks the additions money is coming from. Then again, such things are not important to those who start such idiotic campaigns.
Just hyperthetically, if minimum wage for a driver was £15.00, would everyone be on the minimum then?
By that I mean if Bloggs Transport is currently paying £9.00 an hour and I’m paying £12.00, will both of us be paying £15.00 or will I be paying £18.00?
albion:
Just hyperthetically, if minimum wage for a driver was £15.00, would everyone be on the minimum then?By that I mean if Bloggs Transport is currently paying £9.00 an hour and I’m paying £12.00, will both of us be paying £15.00 or will I be paying £18.00?
Good point, and will class 1 command £18-£20 and hour, seeing as class 2 work will obviously pay £15. Unworkable
In theory if wages went up, the cost of everything else would go up pro rata cancelling out the benefits
peirre:
In theory if wages went up, the cost of everything else would go up pro rata cancelling out the benefits
Yes and no. I don’t buy into that bs. If a load of baked beans rises by 30% to cover the extra wages, it’s not 30% on every can. Say there’s 12000 tins on a load, and that 30% is £200, that’s £200 divided by 12000. Each can goes up by 1p as the rise is less than that. So if you buy 100 items at Tesco, your shopping goes up a quid. But your wages may well have gone up by 30-40%
Radar19:
peirre:
Harry Monk:
Why do people start these idiotic petitions?I wonder if certain external factors play a part?
Are they Imperial pints?
Yeah i reckon so, tankard with a big o’l handle is going to 568ml er…sorry…1 pint…
A tall tapered european glass would be 500ml… both would fit under most bridges though…
OVLOV JAY:
peirre:
In theory if wages went up, the cost of everything else would go up pro rata cancelling out the benefitsYes and no. I don’t buy into that bs. If a load of baked beans rises by 30% to cover the extra wages, it’s not 30% on every can. Say there’s 12000 tins on a load, and that 30% is £200, that’s £200 divided by 12000. Each can goes up by 1p as the rise is less than that. So if you buy 100 items at Tesco, your shopping goes up a quid. But your wages may well have gone up by 30-40%
It depends if Peirre is looking at just HGV wages going up, or if it triggers a wave of every industry deciding what they are worth. If forkies, shelf stackers, plasterers etc all think ,’ yeah, my wages are ok, no petition here’, then you are right, it doesn’t add much more. However if said forkies, shelf stackers and plasterers all think, well I’d like another £5.00 an hour so that we have parity, then peirre is nearer the mark.