The obvious answer is… when the UK authorities start to care as much as their Dutch counterparts and separate cyclists into cycle lanes.
nobody knows outcome yet but no doubt the lorry driver will be arrested and assumed guilty RIP to cyclist mind
Boomerang Dave:
The obvious answer is… when the UK authorities start to care as much as their Dutch counterparts and separate cyclists into cycle lanes.
How would they be able to achieve that on High Holborn? - where this accident happened.
It will stop when cyclists start making changes for themselves, the haulage industry seems to be taking action, free cpc course, cameras, stickers on the back, training videos… What have cyclists done?
Saaamon:
It will stop when cyclists start making changes for themselves, the haulage industry seems to be taking action, free cpc course, cameras, stickers on the back, training videos… What have cyclists done?
Yep! I agree. Surely, cyclists also need to be taking more responsibility for their own safety and well being on the road. I’m not saying some drivers couldn’t do with a good flogging for their rather unprofessional actions, just that cyclists could do more.
Would it be fair to say that its cyclists putting themselves in unsafe places in relation to a truck and not a truck getting into a place making it unsafe for cyclists ?
It’ll only stop when commercial drivers,who are most at risk of ending up at the wrong end of a causing death by careless/dangerous driving charge,have the bottle to stand together in calling for cyclists to be removed from the roads and put on the pavements and/or cycleways where they belong and be prepared to park up and stay at home until they get it.The idea of mixing road traffic with cyclists especially in places like busy urban areas or fast dual carriageways is untenable and needs to stop.Without such action expect to see ever more drivers facing ever tougher sentencing for the ever increasing rate of cyclist v truck/bus collisions.
ROG:
Would it be fair to say that its cyclists putting themselves in unsafe places in relation to a truck and not a truck getting into a place making it unsafe for cyclists ?
ROG you seem to have connections at the decision making levels so why the silence from HGV trainers and the driver training establishment saying that things have reached the limit in what drivers can reasonably be expected to deal with and put up with regarding cyclists mixing with motor traffic and it needs to stop.
The only way that it will stop is when cyclists are forced off the roads by law because the stupid lemmings obviously aren’t going to take themselves out of harms way by their own choice.In fact it seems like it’s ever increasingly a case of the opposite. etc etc
Saaamon:
It will stop when cyclists start making changes for themselves, the haulage industry seems to be taking action, free cpc course, cameras, stickers on the back, training videos… What have cyclists done?
^^^^ what he said!!!
They will stop dying when they stop riding up the inside of trucks and buses and start keeping their place in traffic.
Carryfast:
ROG:
Would it be fair to say that its cyclists putting themselves in unsafe places in relation to a truck and not a truck getting into a place making it unsafe for cyclists ?ROG you seem to have connections at the decision making levels so why the silence from HGV trainers and the driver training establishment saying that things have reached the limit in what drivers can reasonably be expected to deal with and put up with regarding cyclists mixing with motor traffic and it needs to stop.
The only way that it will stop is when cyclists are forced off the roads by law because the stupid lemmings obviously aren’t going to take themselves out of harms way by their own choice.In fact it seems like it’s ever increasingly a case of the opposite. etc etc
I would say that trainers will say the same as me - a LGV driver can only reasonably do so much and any other road user acting unreasonably is responsible for their own actions
Logic dictates that a LGV driver or any other driver does not want to take risks around vulnerable road users but the actions of the vulnerable make it nigh on impossible for drivers to avoid incidents
I know training is not the answer to everything but surely some compulsory basic training for the vulnerable will help to reduce the incidents
Pity there is no training for common sense !!
Carryfast:
The only way that it will stop is when cyclists are forced off the roads by law because the stupid lemmings obviously aren’t going to take themselves out of harms way by their own choice.In fact it seems like it’s ever increasingly a case of the opposite. etc etc
Thats just ridiculous, why should cyclists be banned from the roads? Would it not be easier to bring cyclists attention to the dangers of lorries and the restricted view we have… Perhaps a safety campaign aimed at cyclists on the tv, similar to drink drive ones would be a good start…
I suppose the one sided views here are natural up to a point, no doubt the other one sided views are currently being aired on a cycling forum.
Cyclists in heavily congested cities like London arn’t going away, and be careful what you wish for as far from putting cyclists on the pavements the result is more likely to be a halving of the present road width for vehicular use, and the rest being cycle use only with draconian fines for those drivers who flout the divides.
Whether you want to see the truth or not there are as many bad drivers as there are bad cyclists, the penalty for being a bad driver though is always going to be dished out to the cyclist as they are the ones who invariably come off worse when things go wrong.
Whether this particular tipper driver is actually to blame for the accident we don’t know at his stage and it may be some weeks before such a decision becomes known, what is irrefutable is that whoever is to blame for this tragic event a man has lost his life and it isn’t the driver of the lorry, RIP chap.
Its high time some of our fraternity took better care out there, set their mirrors to the correct overlapping angles to eradicate blind spots, kept their mirrors and glass clean and in good condition and actually looked in them as and when needed.
Thats not to take away from anyone, cyclists included the responsibility to take as much care of themselves as they reasonably can.
We at the end of the day are the professional road users in charge of vehicles that can kill and main very easily, if we don’t sort our act out (including taking care of cyclists even if they are completely reckless and wrong and that is a minority of them) then we will find ourselves legislated against till the pips squeak.
Saaamon:
It will stop when cyclists start making changes for themselves, the haulage industry seems to be taking action, free cpc course, cameras, stickers on the back, training videos… What have cyclists done?
A very fair point put there fella the whole mindset of the majority of the cycling community in london is totally wrong,they are completeley ignorant of every other road user they deliberatley run red lights,ride on the pavement abuse anyone that gets in their way the sooner they have to be insured and licensed the better in my opinion !!
Turbovision:
Boomerang Dave:
The obvious answer is… when the UK authorities start to care as much as their Dutch counterparts and separate cyclists into cycle lanes.How would they be able to achieve that on High Holborn? - where this accident happened.
Sorry but to be blunt… tis a silly question. Perhaps you can explain why it can’t be achieved there. Keeping in mind that it works perfectly well in every city, town and village in Holland, has done for decades and almost every cloggie rides a bike. Very few fat cloggies and all have respect for cyclists.
By the way, if you put High Holborn, into Amsterdam, Utrecht, Arnhem, Den Haag, Maastricht or any of the other large cities in Holland, it would be a much wider than the average road.
Saaamon:
It will stop when cyclists start making changes for themselves, the haulage industry seems to be taking action, free cpc course, cameras, stickers on the back, training videos… What have cyclists done?
I absolutely agree !!!
I think the time has come to regulate the cyclists somewhat…
compulsory road riding training and a system of registration for starters!
I think MOST LGV drivers are acutely aware of the vulnerabilities of cyclists (except for the reckless ones) so to keep blaming the driver or the LGV is ridiculous, it takes 2 to tango so to speak! 
regulation of cyclists will never happen though, as it will be seen by joe public and the loonie greenie parties (and possibly the lib dems too) as anti green ETC ETC… and no political party wants that!
B…
Saaamon:
Carryfast:
The only way that it will stop is when cyclists are forced off the roads by law because the stupid lemmings obviously aren’t going to take themselves out of harms way by their own choice.In fact it seems like it’s ever increasingly a case of the opposite. etc etcThats just ridiculous, why should cyclists be banned from the roads? Would it not be easier to bring cyclists attention to the dangers of lorries and the restricted view we have… Perhaps a safety campaign aimed at cyclists on the tv, similar to drink drive ones would be a good start…
The fact is there is no safety campaign which can sort out the basic incompatibility between cyclists and trucks/buses ( and even cars to a certain degree ) mixing together on the roads and that issue can only be fixed by getting cyclists where they belong on the pavements using shared cycle/walkways and then put cyclists under the responsibility that if they cause death or injury to pedestrians it’s them who’ll be facing the same charges and penalties as those presently faced by drivers in the event of hitting cyclists.It’s been said on here before cyclists are actually not much different to pedestrians from the point of view of speed and vulnerability so it’s on the pavement where cyclists belong not the roads.
ROG:
Carryfast:
ROG:
Would it be fair to say that its cyclists putting themselves in unsafe places in relation to a truck and not a truck getting into a place making it unsafe for cyclists ?ROG you seem to have connections at the decision making levels so why the silence from HGV trainers and the driver training establishment saying that things have reached the limit in what drivers can reasonably be expected to deal with and put up with regarding cyclists mixing with motor traffic and it needs to stop.
The only way that it will stop is when cyclists are forced off the roads by law because the stupid lemmings obviously aren’t going to take themselves out of harms way by their own choice.In fact it seems like it’s ever increasingly a case of the opposite. etc etc
I would say that trainers will say the same as me - a LGV driver can only reasonably do so much and any other road user acting unreasonably is responsible for their own actions
Logic dictates that a LGV driver or any other driver does not want to take risks around vulnerable road users but the actions of the vulnerable make it nigh on impossible for drivers to avoid incidentsI know training is not the answer to everything but surely some compulsory basic training for the vulnerable will help to reduce the incidents
Pity there is no training for common sense !!
Any driver with any sense knows that it’s unsafe to mix road traffic,especially trucks and buses,with cyclists on the road end of.In just the same way that no driver would want to drive in an environment where pedestrians shared the road with road traffic.Training isn’t the issue.The problem is simply that cycling on the road,especially close to trucks and buses is too dangerous,regardless of how you dress it up.
Bungle666:
I think the time has come to regulate the cyclists somewhat…compulsory road riding training and a system of registration for starters!
Just not workable mate.
What we need is a complete re-design of the road network. It would create masses of employment, revive the economy and make our roads much safer for everyone.